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	<title>Comments on: Optimization Mistakes that Kill Startups</title>
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	<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/</link>
	<description>Unlocking Startup Growth</description>
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		<title>By: Donna @  Business for Sale</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-12823</link>
		<dc:creator>Donna @  Business for Sale</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Aug 2010 17:26:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-12823</guid>
		<description>Optimization and testing are concepts that are still very much alien to more traditional marketeers, and to say that I&#039;m learning loads from your blog would be the understatement of my career. Your insight is proving invaluable in my ongoing marketing education, Sean, and I salute you for that.

Regards

Donna</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Optimization and testing are concepts that are still very much alien to more traditional marketeers, and to say that I&#8217;m learning loads from your blog would be the understatement of my career. Your insight is proving invaluable in my ongoing marketing education, Sean, and I salute you for that.</p>
<p>Regards</p>
<p>Donna</p>
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		<title>By: Sean</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-9722</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 01:49:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-9722</guid>
		<description>Sorry for the slow response this time :-)  I missed your second comment.  I think we&#039;re on the same page here.  It&#039;s great to have more users to be able to iterate faster - but you don&#039;t necessarily have to acquire these early users in the most efficient way.  It&#039;s worth thinking about a good first user experience, just no need to obsess over fine tuning it.  Before scaling growth you definitely should obsess over an efficient acquisition/conversion process.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry for the slow response this time <img src='http://startup-marketing.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' />   I missed your second comment.  I think we&#8217;re on the same page here.  It&#8217;s great to have more users to be able to iterate faster &#8211; but you don&#8217;t necessarily have to acquire these early users in the most efficient way.  It&#8217;s worth thinking about a good first user experience, just no need to obsess over fine tuning it.  Before scaling growth you definitely should obsess over an efficient acquisition/conversion process.</p>
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		<title>By: ArticleSave :: Uncategorized :: How to Prepare for Conversion and Optimization</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-9630</link>
		<dc:creator>ArticleSave :: Uncategorized :: How to Prepare for Conversion and Optimization</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Mar 2010 07:08:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-9630</guid>
		<description>[...] this week he wrote a great article about premature optimization and the mistakes startup companies make in their rushed efforts to convert visitors into customers [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] this week he wrote a great article about premature optimization and the mistakes startup companies make in their rushed efforts to convert visitors into customers [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Christopher Griffin</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-9607</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher Griffin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 17:55:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-9607</guid>
		<description>Hey Sean:

Thanks for the response.  A few quick thoughts.  First, when I say, I think optimization can help accelerate the path to PMF, I don&#039;t mean that the aim of the optimization should be to maximize conversion through the funnel to the point of marginal returns.  I just mean that you should optimize just enough to get enough users so you can consistently test them.  So, the focus is on maximizing the number of times through the iteration loop by shortening the feedback loop not on maximizing your ROI on conversion.  I&#039;m not convinced that I am necessarily correct on this, just putting it out there for feedback.  Second, and I would love to hear your thoughts on this, as it could shed light on my first point and clear it up for me, there seems to be something of a chicken and egg problem here.  To achieve PMF, one needs to survey users and then realign the product around what resonates with the must have users, but you need users to survey.  Assuming you go live with too few users to survey, you need some way of getting users, otherwise, you can&#039;t collect the data you need to achieve PMF.  Going from zero users to enough to survey probably requires some level of optimization as you need to get people from visitor&gt;sign up&gt;experiencing the core experience.  The tradeoff would be worth it when you are going from zero users to enough to test.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Sean:</p>
<p>Thanks for the response.  A few quick thoughts.  First, when I say, I think optimization can help accelerate the path to PMF, I don&#8217;t mean that the aim of the optimization should be to maximize conversion through the funnel to the point of marginal returns.  I just mean that you should optimize just enough to get enough users so you can consistently test them.  So, the focus is on maximizing the number of times through the iteration loop by shortening the feedback loop not on maximizing your ROI on conversion.  I&#8217;m not convinced that I am necessarily correct on this, just putting it out there for feedback.  Second, and I would love to hear your thoughts on this, as it could shed light on my first point and clear it up for me, there seems to be something of a chicken and egg problem here.  To achieve PMF, one needs to survey users and then realign the product around what resonates with the must have users, but you need users to survey.  Assuming you go live with too few users to survey, you need some way of getting users, otherwise, you can&#8217;t collect the data you need to achieve PMF.  Going from zero users to enough to survey probably requires some level of optimization as you need to get people from visitor&gt;sign up&gt;experiencing the core experience.  The tradeoff would be worth it when you are going from zero users to enough to test.</p>
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		<title>By: Sean</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-9606</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 17:53:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-9606</guid>
		<description>Thanks Seph,

The details of tracking are pretty confusing but I&#039;ll do my best to explain them (with some help from my friend Hiten Shah at KISSmetrics).  User level funnel tracking refers to using people as the base unit of measurement, NOT pageviews, visitors or events. Think of this as being able to drill down to see individual people who dropped off at a specific point in the funnel versus just seeing a count.

Most packages, including Google Analytics, won&#039;t track user level funnels. In the past this type of tracking was only available by building it yourself. Packages on the high-end such as Omniture do have user-level tracking, as part of their comprehensive solutions, but the costs for high-end packages make them not an option for startups.  Hope this helps clear it up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Seph,</p>
<p>The details of tracking are pretty confusing but I&#8217;ll do my best to explain them (with some help from my friend Hiten Shah at KISSmetrics).  User level funnel tracking refers to using people as the base unit of measurement, NOT pageviews, visitors or events. Think of this as being able to drill down to see individual people who dropped off at a specific point in the funnel versus just seeing a count.</p>
<p>Most packages, including Google Analytics, won&#8217;t track user level funnels. In the past this type of tracking was only available by building it yourself. Packages on the high-end such as Omniture do have user-level tracking, as part of their comprehensive solutions, but the costs for high-end packages make them not an option for startups.  Hope this helps clear it up.</p>
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		<title>By: Lesenswert: Passwörter, Stefan Glänzer, Soundcloud, ClickandBuy, Facebook, Optimization Mistakes :: deutsche-startups.de</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-9603</link>
		<dc:creator>Lesenswert: Passwörter, Stefan Glänzer, Soundcloud, ClickandBuy, Facebook, Optimization Mistakes :: deutsche-startups.de</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 13:47:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-9603</guid>
		<description>[...] Optimization Mistakes that Kill Startups I once believed optimization was the secret weapon that could make almost any startup successful. It was certainly a critical part of reaching millions of users in each of my first five startup marketing roles. At a couple of startups we saw a tripling of conversion rates from a single experiment. When we tripled conversion rates, we tripled the effectiveness of every future marketing dollar. Startup Marketing Blog [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Optimization Mistakes that Kill Startups I once believed optimization was the secret weapon that could make almost any startup successful. It was certainly a critical part of reaching millions of users in each of my first five startup marketing roles. At a couple of startups we saw a tripling of conversion rates from a single experiment. When we tripled conversion rates, we tripled the effectiveness of every future marketing dollar. Startup Marketing Blog [...]</p>
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		<title>By: AOL Sees Display Decline; Another Googler Leaves To Run A Company; For Q2, Sorrell Seeing Strength And Caveats; MediaMath Offers MathClarity</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-9598</link>
		<dc:creator>AOL Sees Display Decline; Another Googler Leaves To Run A Company; For Q2, Sorrell Seeing Strength And Caveats; MediaMath Offers MathClarity</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 05:06:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-9598</guid>
		<description>[...] Startup marketing guru, Sean Ellis, looks at &quot;Optimization mistakes that kill startups&quot; including optimizing customer acquisition too early in the process, a lack of deliberate methodology in discovering channels and optimizing them and something Ellis calls &quot;killing the love.&quot; Read about it. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Startup marketing guru, Sean Ellis, looks at &quot;Optimization mistakes that kill startups&quot; including optimizing customer acquisition too early in the process, a lack of deliberate methodology in discovering channels and optimizing them and something Ellis calls &quot;killing the love.&quot; Read about it. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Sean</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-9597</link>
		<dc:creator>Sean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 03:04:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-9597</guid>
		<description>Hey Chris, 

I agree that more active users would help most startups achieve product market fit more quickly.  However, I don’t believe it’s worth borrowing resources pre p/m fit from core product just to get a higher percentage of users through the funnel.  This is debatable and I’d love to hear thoughts on why you think it may be worth the tradeoff.   

Your business is one of the exceptions I mentioned - existing users benefit when you add more active users. Because of this network effect, you guys should be optimizing from the beginning.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Chris, </p>
<p>I agree that more active users would help most startups achieve product market fit more quickly.  However, I don’t believe it’s worth borrowing resources pre p/m fit from core product just to get a higher percentage of users through the funnel.  This is debatable and I’d love to hear thoughts on why you think it may be worth the tradeoff.   </p>
<p>Your business is one of the exceptions I mentioned &#8211; existing users benefit when you add more active users. Because of this network effect, you guys should be optimizing from the beginning.</p>
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		<title>By: Seph</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-9596</link>
		<dc:creator>Seph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 02:44:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-9596</guid>
		<description>Great post.  Two questions though - I&#039;m not really sure what you mean by &quot;user level funnel tracking&quot;.  Could you please elaborate on that a bit?  

And when you say off the shelf analytics software won&#039;t track the user level funnel, do you mean Google Analytics - or just other simpler analytics package?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post.  Two questions though &#8211; I&#8217;m not really sure what you mean by &#8220;user level funnel tracking&#8221;.  Could you please elaborate on that a bit?  </p>
<p>And when you say off the shelf analytics software won&#8217;t track the user level funnel, do you mean Google Analytics &#8211; or just other simpler analytics package?</p>
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		<title>By: Christopher Griffin</title>
		<link>http://startup-marketing.com/optimization-mistakes-that-kill-startups/comment-page-1/#comment-9594</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher Griffin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Mar 2010 02:11:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://startup-marketing.com/?p=660#comment-9594</guid>
		<description>Hi Sean:

Great post, just a quick question.  Can&#039;t early optimization also help a company achieve PMF more quickly?  Optimization of funnels that drive users to the core experience should increase the speed at which you get enough users to start surveying for PMF and it should increase the frequency at which you can survey, thus, shortening the feedback loop and iteration cycle.  Doesn&#039;t that jive with your assertion that it&#039;s important to remove bottlenecks and roadblocks from the core experience to expose the love?  Isn&#039;t that essentially what optimization is about?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Sean:</p>
<p>Great post, just a quick question.  Can&#8217;t early optimization also help a company achieve PMF more quickly?  Optimization of funnels that drive users to the core experience should increase the speed at which you get enough users to start surveying for PMF and it should increase the frequency at which you can survey, thus, shortening the feedback loop and iteration cycle.  Doesn&#8217;t that jive with your assertion that it&#8217;s important to remove bottlenecks and roadblocks from the core experience to expose the love?  Isn&#8217;t that essentially what optimization is about?</p>
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